Thorp Air Command - T18.net
http://t18.net/thorpforum/

Anniversaries
http://t18.net/thorpforum/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=7638		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Hagle347 [ Wed Aug 13, 2014 10:10 am ]
Post subject:  Anniversaries
It was on this date in 1972 that I was in a Thorp crash with my Dad (Jack Hagle). We took off in N110JH from the McCullom Airport in Marietta GA for a fun flight. Dad had recently returned from Oshkosh. At 100 feet the engine failed. As you guys know, at 100 feet you don't have many options. Dad had thought the engine might hang in at partial power - it didn't, but he had started a left turn to try a quick pattern back to the runway. The Thorp hit hard still in a slight left turn. The impact hard enough to bend both main landing gear backwards. The upper engine mount failed and allowed the engine to droop slightly. 110JH also had a glass gascolator that shattered upon impact. It wasn't long before the fire started. My dad got out and then realized that I was still in the cockpit. He crawled back in to the burning cockpit, disconnected my seatbelt and told me to get out. Just after I cleared the airplane, the fiberglass fuel tank ruptured dropping 12 gallons of fuel in a burning cockpit.
At the hospital, Dad was treated for second and third degree burns as well as a spinal compression due to the airplane being in that slight left turn. I had first, second and third degree burns.
My recovery in the hospital was 2 1/2 weeks, Dad was slightly longer. He also had to wear a back brace for 4 months. In December of 1972, he was cleared and returned to flying for Delta.

The only useable parts left from 110JH were the horizontal and vertical stab. Both of which were X-rayed at the Delta Air Lines Technical Ops center to check for any damage. In 1975, Dad ordered a bunch of materials from Ken Knowles and started the building process again.
It was this airplane that I soloed in 1979 and continues to fly as N45881.
Author:  Fraser MacPhee [ Wed Aug 13, 2014 1:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anniversaries
Cool story, Chuck!!
Author:  jrevens [ Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anniversaries
That is a very inspirational story, Chuck. Talk about "getting back on the horse"! Thank you so much for sharing it with us. That was just a few years before I started building my T-18.
Author:  Hagle347 [ Wed Aug 13, 2014 8:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anniversaries
Hagle347 wrote:
It was on this date in 1972 that I was in a Thorp crash with my Dad (Jack Hagle). We took off in N110JH from the McCullom Airport in Marietta GA for a fun flight. Dad had recently returned from Oshkosh. At 100 feet the engine failed. As you guys know, at 100 feet you don't have many options. Dad had thought the engine might hang in at partial power - it didn't, but he had started a left turn to try a quick pattern back to the runway. The Thorp hit hard still in a slight left turn. The impact hard enough to bend both main landing gear backwards. The upper engine mount failed and allowed the engine to droop slightly. 110JH also had a glass gascolator that shattered upon impact. It wasn't long before the fire started. My dad got out and then realized that I was still in the cockpit. He crawled back in to the burning cockpit, disconnected my seatbelt and told me to get out. Just after I cleared the airplane, the fiberglass fuel tank ruptured dropping 12 gallons of fuel in a burning cockpit.
At the hospital, Dad was treated for second and third degree burns as well as a spinal compression due to the airplane being in that slight left turn. I had first, second and third degree burns.
My recovery in the hospital was 2 1/2 weeks, Dad was slightly longer. He also had to wear a back brace for 4 months. In December of 1972, he was cleared and returned to flying for Delta.

The only useable parts left from 110JH were the horizontal and vertical stab. Both of which were X-rayed at the Delta Air Lines Technical Ops center to check for any damage. In 1975, Dad ordered a bunch of materials from Ken Knowles and started the building process again.
It was this airplane that I soloed in 1979 and continues to fly as N45881.



Terry A. Hagle
N66WT
N218TH
Author:  James Grahn [ Wed Aug 13, 2014 8:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anniversaries
Never knew that Terry. Pretty awesome.
Cubes
Author:  jrevens [ Wed Aug 13, 2014 11:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anniversaries
jrevens wrote:
That is a very inspirational story, Chuck. Talk about "getting back on the horse"! Thank you so much for sharing it with us. That was just a few years before I started building my T-18.

Forgive me, Terry. I just followed the lead of the previous post... should've looked up your personal info. I'm glad Fraser didn't call you something really insulting. ::)
Author:  flyingfool [ Thu Aug 14, 2014 10:36 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Anniversaries
That is an amazing story that I'm sure is difficult to relive for sure. Thank God both of you survived albeit with required hospital stays and I'm sure some therapy etc to fully recover from that awful event.

The story does cause me to stop and ponder the idea about having the fuel in the fuselage. I think your story stated that the fuel tank was fiberglass but ruptured AFTER you had gotten out. I wonder if the results MIGHT have been different if the tank had been aluminum. Impossible to say I suppose. And maybe it was the heat or flames of the already existing fire that caused the fiberglass tank to rupture afterwards rather than impact itself. Which may not have occurred at least not as fast if the tank was metal versus fiberglass. But who really knows?

I sure like the idea of the reliability of gravity feed for the engine from the fuselage tank versus electric pumps to feed fuel from the wings. However the possibility of having a small baggage compartment up front (I think RV-7's have this type of feature) along with a small header tank instead of a large fuselage tank would be nice too?????? But is it worth giving up gravity feed? I'm not so sure.

Having lived through this horrible ordeal with the fuel tank rupturing and a fire, what are your thoughts about removing the fuel from the fuselage?

I do not wish to dredge up any bad emotions with this beyond the anniversary date. So I honestly mean no disrespect, I'm just trying to learn as a newbie in this Thorp addiction I seem to have been bitten with.
Author:  Hagle347 [ Thu Aug 14, 2014 11:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Anniversaries
Hi Tom, Welcome.

As there are no Bad Questions - only unasked ones. I'll start the answer to your question about fuel in the fuselage by answering that actions speak louder than words. I've got 66WT - a T-18C (folding wing) that I'm putting back together after it was taken apart for paint. Longer story.
And then there's what will be 218TH - a standard T-18. I certainly don't have any reservations about the design. Your comments about fuel in wings and pumps are very valid. I also don't know many Thorps flying today that have fiberglass fuel tanks. And Lee Walton would be the one to chime in about Thorps that had issues with fuel tanks after accidents.
I am convinced that the design is safe the way it is. John Thorp designed a heck of an airplane.

As to RV's - I've flown in RV-8's and they are nice airplanes. Just not designed by an Aeronautical Engineer with decades of experience designing aircraft. I also like to say that without the Thorp there would be no RV's. They certainly know how to market designs.

I have no reservations about getting back in the Thorp. I dealt with those fears a long time ago. John Thorp designed the fuel to be in the fuselage and for weight and balance that's a good place for it to be. There are also no bad emotions associated with the day the airplane crashed. As a 12 year old, the mind does well to put the body in shock. I have no direct memory of the impact or the resulting fire. It was only after my father released my seatbelt and told me to get out that I got up and out of the burning airplane. I do remember the 'whoosh' as the fuel tank burned through and dumped the remaining gas into the cockpit. (just like the movies..)

Good Luck with your search for a Thorp. There are some good ones out there to be had for what are truly bargain prices when you compare a comparable RV. Someday maybe the values will be more equal..

Off the soapbox now,

Terry
Author:  flyingfool [ Fri Aug 15, 2014 3:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anniversaries
Hagle347,

My "search" for a Thorpe is more a search of my own self. As the only way I can really undertake this financially is if I build one. So the real searching is going on in the six inches between my two ears!

I have to determine whether or not it is realistic that I can undertake such an project and actually complete it.

Financially building it by partial kits (S-18) and a set of plans is the only way fiscally I can do it. Possibly buying a partial completed project. So that question is answered.

I'm still struggling if I can really complete the project given my life and the time I have available etc. Obviously the only person that can answer that is me.

I'm starting to lean towards buying the S-18 plans and maybe buying some basic tools. Like riveter, rivet squeezer, and I need a bunch more clecos and some bucking bars etc and then ordering a small kit for the ailerons or flaps or tail and give it a try and see where it goes from there. At that point I won't have very much invested into if it doesn't seem to work out for me. And I probably could sell whatever I have built to give someone else a start. So it would be a way of tip toeing my way into the building process. Maybe if I ever complet the project I can call it "Crap Shoot". Because when I started the building process it is a crap shoot if I wouild ever complete it!

The real unknown is that my wife has NO IDEA what I'm thinking about. So this may be a surprise to her! :o

Igor Sikorski I believe once said: "Aviation is a very pleasurable mental illness". And I'm definatly mental!
Author:  Rich Brazell [ Fri Aug 15, 2014 4:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anniversaries
I am not sure what your skill level is with aluminum (cutting , drilling, bending , bucking rivets etc.) , but it might be worth your time to attend one of the EAA 2 day sheet metal classes . I did when they had it at the Corona, Ca. location (Spruce) . They teach you the basics when it comes to using aluminum . They supply all the tools and materials and at the end of the 2nd day you walk out with a completed section of an aircraft (in my case it was a flap section) . You go thru the basics of drilling , deburring , counter sinking , back riveting , riveting using bucking bars , proper bending of sheet aluminum , the use of a squeeze riveter and a whole bunch more basic stuff you can use to get started , rather than trying to assemble something in a dark closet with Fraser ! ?

Just an idea . They list the workshop locations on the EAA web site .

RB O0
Author:  Ryan Allen [ Fri Aug 15, 2014 5:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anniversaries
if you just want a plane, and don't necessarily care about the build, there is a T-18 on Barnstormers for $10K. I don't think you can build one for that. All you need is an engine and a prop, and you are flying.
Page 1 of 1 All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
https://www.phpbb.com/