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Looking to buy
http://t18.net/thorpforum/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=6379		 Page 1 of 3
Author:  rgilbride [ Sun Nov 07, 2010 9:16 am ]
Post subject:  Looking to buy
I'm considering purchasing an older Thorp T-18, N9557, serial# 197 built in 1970. Two questions:
1. Are there any significant design modifications made after that date that affect the airworthiness or performance of the aircraft?
2. Does anyone have any personal information regarding this aircraft?
Thanks in advance for any information.
Author:  leewwalton [ Sun Nov 07, 2010 11:26 am ]
Post subject:  Looking to buy
Rick,
On the main forum page, look under "Technical - Thorp ADs and Safety Issues - Inspection Items for a T-18 Purchaser"

http://www.thorp18.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=5802

That should cover anything you need regarding making sure the airplane has had the necessary safety items addressed.

I have no personal experience regarding that airplane other than it's been on Barnstormers for a while and I personally think it's kind of cool looking, in a retro - early - T-18 sort of way. If the rest of the airplane is put together as nice as the panel it should be a nice airplane.
Author:  SHIPCHIEF [ Fri Dec 16, 2011 3:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Looking to buy
I'm also interested in buying a T-18. I'm considering a local one with a raised turtle deck.
I've heard that a series of raised turtledeck T-18s had been built as a group at one time.
Can anyone shed some light on this?
Author:  BobMoe [ Sat Dec 17, 2011 8:33 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Looking to buy
There's an article in Sport Aviation
August 1967

Bob
Author:  dickwolff [ Sat Dec 17, 2011 12:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Looking to buy
I offer this advice based on my own experience FWIW:

Make sure you really want a T18 and have the flying skills to operate it. A lot of these airplanes flying today are owned by high time, high experienced folks. They love them.

Do your homework. Study the "official" accident reports. Talk to as many owners, face-to-face or by phone, as you can, especially new owners of pre-owned airplanes. Talk to past owners for some unbiased opinions.

Don't even bother if the airplane does not have complete and impeccable logs and documentation.

When you look at an airplane, it is imperative that you bring a knowledgeable T18 person with you to help inspect. Take nothing for granted. Remove everything you can reasonably remove for the inspection. You need to get in there and REALLY look at the details.

Caveat Emptor

I'd be happy to discuss my experience in more detail on the phone. 519.396.5720 EST
Author:  SHIPCHIEF [ Sat Dec 17, 2011 4:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Looking to buy
Bobmoe;
Thanks for the tip, unfortunately, my SA collection only goes back about 30 years...off and on.
I just joined the Thorp Newsletter, but haven't been cleared thru administration yet.
Are the Thorp related articles archived here?
Dickwolf;
Thanks for the offer of advice. I'll be wanting to take you up on that.

I met the local Thorp ambassador (Paul MacMicheal) last Tuesday at our EAA Chapter 326 meeting & Christmas dinner...along with the Northwest Thorp Retirement Contingent. Nice bunch of guys. I'd never really related that they were Thorp enthusiasts when I was attending regular chapter meetings until I became interested in T-18s.
Author:  BobMoe [ Sat Dec 17, 2011 5:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Looking to buy
Pm me and Ill send. It's on eaa.org
Author:  leewwalton [ Sat Dec 17, 2011 5:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Looking to buy
Scott,
I activated your account look for a newsletter in the next week (that goes for all of you MAS Members). The online archive is up to 50 something right now with 70 something to go. There are a few round-back mentions in what is loaded there. Just type in round-back in the search bar of the main T18.net site.

Couple of things, the old SA articles are not going to tell you that much. They're written in a different era/time when people were actually excited about the "round-back" T-18's. Other then aesthetics there's nothing wrong with a round-back, in fact they may even have a slight speed advantage over the standard T-18. The same way the P-51B/C had a speed advantage over the D model. There were a dozen or so being made at one time or another but they really didn't pan out. Mostly because the T-18 is a "boxy" airplane, trying to put curved lines on a square box just didn't work out when the two surfaces had to mate. Some tried forward facing doors, some gull wing, some over the top and a few even rounded the turtle deck and left the aft canopy deck there. In the end they paved the way for those who came later in proving that wavering from a good design will only add time and complexity to an already elegantly simple design.

From a buyers standpoint realize that a round-back may valued less than a standard T-18 only because it's "different"/non-standard.

Paul is a good resource he should be able to tell you whatever you need to know.

To Dicks points about flight experience although he's right to a point that many of our ranks are experienced pilots, there are also many of us that are not. The T-18 is not twitchy, touchy or anything but an honest flying airplane. You just have to remember it's a taildragger and that things happen quicker than in a Cub, 150, 172 etc. I have never felt uncomfortable in any Thorp, in my opinion they're the best flying airplane around.
Author:  SHIPCHIEF [ Sat Dec 17, 2011 6:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Looking to buy
Thanks Lee;
To me, Thorps have always been here, in the Great Northwet where I live, and are probably the first planes that I identified as being homebuilt. Newer homebuilts get all the press attention, but a quick summary of performance, price etc shows the T-18 to be a contender still.
Plus, our local Thorp community is here to support each other.
Author:  SHIPCHIEF [ Sat Dec 17, 2011 7:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Looking to buy
Bob;
I sent you a PM (I think) I'm not too good at this aspect.
Author:  dickwolff [ Sat Dec 17, 2011 8:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Looking to buy
Lee's point is well taken. I am *fairly* new to the Thorp community so I don't really know what the full range of flying experience is in the crowd. I've read stories in the newsletters about 16 year olds doing their private licenses in them. On the other hand, in the same set of newsletters I was struck by the number of stories about accidents and incidents. (I've even seen one.)

I certainly am in no position to speak about the flying qualities from personal experience. I've never flown mine and there's a lot of work to do before she can fly again.... but that's another story.
Author:  BobMoe [ Mon Dec 19, 2011 10:38 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Looking to buy
BobMoe wrote:
There's an article in Sport Aviation
August 1967

Bob


I uploaded article to this site:

http://www.angelfire.com/pro2/gsa/DFQB/ ... img008?i=3
Author:  Victor Thompson [ Mon Dec 19, 2011 12:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Looking to buy
Bob: Great article. This is a great post.

Thanks for posting the T-18 article, especially for those of us that may not have the older copies of Sport Aviation.

In the article it mentioned Bill Warwick and his RB.

My father 1st saw Bill Warwick's Thorp T18 at a early 1960's, I think it was 1965 EAA Convention in Rockford Illinois.

Dad fell in love with the design and refered to it as a rocket.

In building C-GIRQ he made it with the standard fuselage.

Attachments:
bill warwick.png
bill warwick.png [ 225.5 KiB | Viewed 24550 times ]
Author:  leewwalton [ Mon Dec 19, 2011 3:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Looking to buy
I went ahead an loaded both of the "Hatchery" articles here rather than link to angelfire. Never can trust external sites. ;)

Attachment:
1967_06_05.pdf [1.27 MiB]
Downloaded 1054 times

Attachment:
1967_08_09.pdf [1.39 MiB]
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Author:  SHIPCHIEF [ Thu Jan 12, 2012 7:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Looking to buy
While waiting for my chance to see the 'roundback' T-18, I read everything I could on this site.
The visit was brief, due to little remaining daylight for the mountain flight back home, but it went well.
Marilyn looks like she fits very well, with cushion thickness being the key to raising her eyes high enough to see over the bow.
It was a bit different for me. I have a tall spine, and can't fit in a Mustang II, but I had head room in this T-18. But the center console and the fuselage side kind of wedged my hip bones, and my shoulders have to be twisted, or my spine leaning to the center of the aircraft to fit. Might get a bit cramped after a while...
Marilyn & I did briefly look over the engine and airframe, both present well. I did not get a chance to start any kind of a pre-buy inspection. The plane has a current inspection and a ride was offered.
I did get to talk some more to Paul McMicheal the local Thorp Ambassador at our EAA Chapter 326 meeting the evening before, he was a big help.
In my quest, I'll be looking for ways to get more room to sit toward the center of the fuselage, and also try to find an S-18 to sit in.
Home built aircraft show a variety of building techniques, don't they? This roundback certainly seems nice in person, and was well executed, with a parallelogram aft lifting canopy. getting in and out presented some initial challenges, but quickly got easier as I figured it out.
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