Thorp Air Command - T18.net

is getting hung up on the port side fuel tank strap attach point at the firewall.

On several occasions when I've needed full right rudder and brake the tip of my right shoe has been trapped between the top of the rudder pedal and the back of the bolt head where it protrudes from the attach point at the firewall.

This has caused some serious butt puckering since it results in being unable to release full right rudder.

Each time I have wiggled free before nastiness resulted but it needs to be addressed ASAP. Looking at the design it would appear that everyone with larger than size 8 feet (mine are a manly size 10) will be affected.

I would like to hear how this has been addressed....to date my solution has been (when I remember to do this...) roll my ankles fully outward and use the far right of that pedal... unfortunately when I gotta do the crosswind dance I forget that rule and find my foot trapped.

A friend has recommended a sheild of some sort and that is being considered... any other ideas?

Hi Tim, The first thing that comes to mind might be to modify your foot wear before you modify the airplane. I've seen numerous Airshow guys wearing the Auto racing shoes. They are more a tight fit without odd edges.

Also, In looking at the photo...How well do your shoes stay within the top edge of the pedal.? With any luck - If you keep the shoe and your foot inside the 'guide' you'll keep your foot away from the bottom of the tank. I remember my Dad saying before every takeoff and landing..."Check your feet. Heels down and only use the ball of feet on the brakes - when necessary".

Hope this helps,


Terry

Tim,
What type of shoes do you wear when flying? I wear a size 11 and have not had any problems, I also wear a light weight pair of running shoe (Onitsuka Tiger, great running shoe) that has a thin sole.

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Bruce Finney
N18JF T-18C #262
Yelm, WA USA

Firstly, make sure your heels are fully down on the floor for landing. Brakes are primarily for taxiing. If you have a floor built up on the top of the fuselage bottom, remove it. Secondly, you can move the rudder pedals back by simply shortening the rudder cables. This can be done by the adjusting turnbuckles. Some brake masters can also be adjusted by turning the clevis fittings. Your setup seems to be adjusted very far forward. I wear size twelve and have no problem.

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Bob Highley
N711SH
SN 835
KLAL

Tim,

I can wear pretty much any shoes I want but I find that running shoes work the best. I also have Cessna pedals on my plane. So far i have not had any issues.

Jim Mantyla

I wear running shoes and absolutely check the position of those clod hoppers when landing/taking off... the most common occurrence is when taxing, taking off or rolling out is a strong left crosswind which requires full right rudder and then god help me needing to add some right brake... the pedal and brake deflection take my right toe to the firewall...

I will look for some shoes that fit closer to the toe since it is the toe only that gets trapped... maybe too much (camel) toe or is it knuckle

I tried it on for size and saw that with my ankles on the floor there is no issue but its that "once in a while "got-cha" I'm worried about.

Maybe my brake pedals have too much deflection?

Not sure how this is possible ? With your heels on the deck , there should be amble clearance . During the heat of battle you may be raising up your right foot on the pedal due to a sub hematoma on the right big toe ! During the next flight I would suggest checking if your heels are indeed on the deck . The only thing else I could suggest is surgery to shorten the offending limb .

As a side note during my early flight testing I made a conscious effort to keep my heels on the deck during taxi and TO , but I found myself landing with the balls of my feet resting on top of the rudder pedals . I quickly cured myself of that bad habit ! BOOM !

RB

SURGERY!!!!!!!!!!




OK...I'll consider it






my wife says I can transplant that wasted length to somewhere it might be more useful

Hi Tim,
Looking at your brake "pedal" I'm wondering if it would make sense to build another so that the place where your toes rest is further aft almost flush with the rudder bar but tilting slightly forward maybe 15 degrees or so. I find in some planes I've flown that I have to really rotate my ankles to apply the brakes which I suspect you too end up doing thus catching your toes on whatever is under the tank. Just a thought
John

I think you have hit the proverbial nail upon the head... full right rudder and brake gets my foot too far forward...
I sat in the airplane today and had a look at the foot position when this occurs... even though my legs are fairly long I still find I must really REACH FOR IT to get full brake and rudder.

I now believe its a geometry issue so in addition to wearing ballerina slippers I am going to modify the pedal so I don't have to make the BIG REACH that results in getting snagged.

You are killin me, Tim!
Love those innuendoes. Anyway, rudder pedal geometry is a personal thing. I recommend removing the pedals. You will find an angle on the back that is simply riveted to the pedal. The brake master attaches to it. You can change the "at rest" angle several ways. An easy way is to simply drill a new master attach hole lower on the angle. That will tilt the pedal aft and give you "power steering". You can also add a spacer to move the pedal slightly aft. That would require drilling out the rivets on the angle to add the spacer. Most pedals are manufactured with a lip on the top edge. I know a lot of guys who use that edge to brake with. That's another possible mod.
I would modify the plane to fit you before I wear ballerina slippers.
Need help, let me know.
Cubes

Tim: Mine have the "lip" Cubes describes . I just slip the top of the shoe into the lip . By the way when I do that my heels rest on the deck . About the surgery...The Post Office and DMV have walk in appointments for routine surgery under the ACA ! Highly skilled Govt. employees to care for all your needs ! BOOM !

RB

Somewhere I mentioned I was having the same problem. I know this is much too late to help Tim. My pedals have the lip as described and the first time it happened I thought I was getting hung up on a bolt so I changed the way the bolts were installed. A few flights later my foot got hung up again. One day I had the fuel tank out for other maintenance and got to looking at the way my feet ride the pedals and how I was actuating the brakes. With a clear view of my feet I finally figured out I was lifting my right foot to put my toes on the top lip to actuate the brakes. My left and right pedals are not made identical (the right pedal is deeper) so they have a slightly different geometry. Initially I just canted my foot a little so I could push on the lip running up the right side of the pedal but I forgot once and almost got hung up again. My final fix was to install aluminum bar stock across the pedal where my toes ride when my heel is on the floor. Now when I rock my foot forward to apply brakes I actually hit something with my toes and the feeling I that I need to lift my foot to get enough movement to apply the brake has gone away. Problem solved without the need to change footwear or fabricating a new pedal.

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Thorp T18
O-320-B3B (160 HP)
68x74 Sterba Propeller

"The joke in aviation is, 'If you want to make a million, you'd better start with £10m.' " -Bruce Dickinson

Here is a picture to go with my previous post.

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Thorp T18
O-320-B3B (160 HP)
68x74 Sterba Propeller

"The joke in aviation is, 'If you want to make a million, you'd better start with £10m.' " -Bruce Dickinson

Should you come to Visalia, Dr. RB, I'm sure would inspect and treat the affected toe. From what I have heard, some of the well known Doctors have come to him for consul, such as Dr. Kildare, Dr. Suse and Dr. Kovereain. I am sure that it won't hurt a bit.

Phil
118BC